Flatstock Europe

[seriplop]

rene needs to stop attacking artists all the freaking time.
it's totally lame and not productive or constructive in anyway.

no artist should have to justify their level of "motivation" , especially to someone who's not involved in any (visible) way.. or even attending for that matter.

are artists supposed to go to please someone who's not even going to be there?


for some people , gigposters are hobby , for other a full time job. and lots , lots in between. of course levels of interest to travel and try to sell/show work are gonna be dependent on people's situations.

[worthless fuckstick]

nice throw in on the worthless thing, cloe.

That was good.

I don't think rene has to chill out at all.

He has made a great point.

I think the europeans should work a little harder.

Because in the long run down the road it's gonna be a great thing for them.

But I happy to see flatstock europe is in hamburg though.

It's a great city to have it in!

My second home in europe.

WF

[seriplop]

well like i said , the europeans i know who do posters are working PLENTY hard and doing tons to promote and show the art , flatstock or not. so i see it as a cheap shot for people here sayin' they should work harder.
fuck i've never met ANYONE who works as hard as bongout does.

it's really none of rene's bussiness who attends or doesn't , everyone has their own freaking life.

and ya , many attendees of our gigs in europe , especially when we play squats , don't understand the fact that we are selling our posters. they seem to think that a poster is inherantly worthless and that we are being sketchy capitalist pigs for selling 'em.

but hey , what do i know?

[piemel]

Geoff, I agree with a lot you just wrote but there seems to be a difference here in expectations and attitude. How many first timers at the first few flatstocks expected anything but a wild adventure?

For the USA their would not have been such a wide success for all cross sections of this scene without flatstock and sxsw. Paul imagine show feeds off that success and that is no disrespect to paul and his amazing set and organizing talents.

The same WILL apply to Europe. They need not only a flatstock but the participants. And they are lacking in that regard.

What type of grease is needed to turn this around? We had the same issue for the first flatstock. We solved it and then got drunk and the rest is history.

And there is one part I disagree. It is not a matter of just time for the euro peeps. The longer they wait the wider the gap and the harder it will become.

[worthless fuckstick]

cloe,

bongout does work hard.

Their studio in Berlin is righteous, but

You are missing the point you were trying to make earlier.

It's going to take a lot of hard work to make the scene happen.

I know we have put it in, both on this side and the other.

And if that was taken as a cheap shot you are sadly mistaken.

It would be a cheap shot if I knew nothing of what people were doing over there,

So off the high horse for a while please.

WF

[MrBlonde7]

I like this discussion because it's opening my eyes a bit on both sides of the pond.

I really wish Zeloot would answer my PM's, btw.

[seriplop]

what gap are you speaking of rene?

like i said earlier , most euro artists seem to be publishing other people's work and either running galleries or organizing art shows in addition to their own work. (and not nearly as many us or canadian artists seem to be doing that. should we all be working harder?)

it seems like there's alot of healthy growth and exchange going on , it just can't be at us level overnight. there just isn't the history there.

for a lot of europens , the fact that this site is in english might be a pretty big barrier to networking here , on gp.
in my experience folks in france (or french speaking parts of belgium) , spain and italy often don't speak very much english and even if they do , aren't confident with it.
it's nothing like holland , germany or switzerland where everyone seems to speak perfect english.


if there's a genuine desire to have more euro artists at flatstock europe , maybe it might be a good idea to have someone contacting those artists in their mother tongue.

maybe have api (or ipi or whatever) reps in different countries to do local / regional outreach.

[gav_beattie]

Personally speaking, from a few years of trying to sell gigposters at shows in Ireland, it's a completely new concept to the average gig-going punter here. "You me to PAY for a poster???" But it is changing slowly, the poster is becoming a valid form of merchandise to see on sale at a gig as opposed to a promotional item of little or no worth.

This perception of the gigposter has been around a lot longer in the US and maybe this is why something like Flatstock seemed to take off quicker than it is in Europe. I think it will build up but not as quickly as Flatstock US has.

[seriplop]

"You me to PAY for a poster???"

that's been our experience in many countries. a lack of perceived worth for a screened poster, heck it's like that in parts of canada still.

things seem to be changing , slowly but surely.

[andydiesel]

it's a worldwide economy these days. why separate us all by continent?

why not have the worldwide poster institute or the poster institute of earth? have people from all over the world on the board working together.